But it was a fun range gun. I think the best point in this review is what do you use it for? The VEPR-12 is definitely an improvement over the Saiga-12, but as far as I can tell it's still a solution looking for a problem. I slicked up the feeding ramp on my first one But in hind sight that was just lazy. You left out a very important feature of the bolt-release button on the VEPR-12, which acts like the bolt release on an AR-15. ive had nothing but issues feeding cheap roundsFTE almost every single time. Sign In; Register . Per 100 or 200. Ratings are relative to all other similar firearms. The first pic is original and the second is modded. But i WILL b racking the hell outta that sgm mag once i get home because the issue seems to be alot worse with the sgm. This is quite obviously no better than a brick for home defense. Finally I had a gun that cycled smoothly and fired effortlessly! The second one I bought was at issue. I might cut my house in half, but there is no way in hell anybody is leaving that place alive. I'm not saying that Shannon's custom polishing job is the answer for everyone, but it definitely worked for me when all the cheaper options were exhausted and may be just the fix for you. the gas piston threaded into the bolt carrier has a little play in it side to side where it actually threads into the bolt carrier. Has anyone else had this problem? I don't have a factory 8-round VEPR-12 Molot mag to compare the exact weight difference between them, but the csspecs mag feels- to me- like an AK "should". This versatile system is often erroneously characterized as a "self-regulating" gas system. Early American export models have no muzzle brake and have a fixed stock rather than a folding stock. there are a ton of gun videos there. The CD, Superformance, and Zombie loads are all the same shit with different hulls. I dont see the Vepr as much of an improvement. Wanted to obtain a collapsible Have to agree with the author. I hope my previous comment doesnt seem anti-2nd. I wouldn't hesitate to use them should the need arise. Is over-penetration what it is supposed to do? I keep my mini-Vulcan leaning on the wall next to my bed with two belt filled cans. Joined Jan 26, 2009 . This review almost had me until two things happened. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. You cannot paste images directly. Chamber: 3" / 76 mm. And instead of rocking the magazines into place like on a standard AK, they simply slot straight into the receiver. Message boards are awesome resources of knowledge. I get lots of help. I received my VEPR-12 shortly after the ban on Russian imports began and probably paid a little too much for it, but what the heck! and yes they first need judge order or arrest u, there arrest found not sound leave them open to law sute Mine runs 2 3/4 Dram (Winchester AA). I got some great help from 505Fire from Vepr.org. I've compiled the 12 gauge 2 2/3" shells for your reference: http://www.doitdarith.com/temp/vepr12/wolfammo12gaugevepr12.html. Maybe in time that will change. Alternate 00 buck with slugs and rock and roll the big apes. The safety on the m1 rifle and several other firearms is in the trigger gaurd. Others it works right out of the box. See Features. lol. Trying to make it a skeet gone is a joke. Yea its all been disassembled, cleaned, an reassembled properly. Day and night difference in performance and reliability. The gun had no problems in cycling 00 buck in either 2- or 3-inch shells. Im no gunsmith or engineer or nothing like that but just visually judging by the internals design i figure the tip of the gas piston inserts into the cavity inside the puck once a round is chamberedgotta be tough with 1cm worth of play in the actual piston. I think shotguns are the best home defense weapon point it in the intruders general direction and youre likely to really ruin their day. The "flexing" and binding of the captured OEM assemblies can rob your system of the efficiency needed to cycle the gun properly. And with it locked back, the trigger is locked. I rarely loan money to friends unless I have no intention of ever having it paid back. I took a look at my Vepr 12 and I cannot see any differences between yours and mine. Why Vepr-12 jams with heavy optic mounted on its top rail? Im hoping its just one of thise situations where it needs to be fired more. Is that normal? There are dimpled impressions in either side of the threads on the end of the bolt carrier where the gas piston screws in that prevent it from being tightened which leads me to believe its supposed to be that way but for there to be ANY wiggle in such a sophisticated gas system seems a little odd to me. 3-gun competition? Double shame for being a shill. The problem arises when optics of certain shapes / sizes are placed on the rail in such position that a shell ejecting can hit the optic (think eotech) slowing/stopping/bouncing the eject . In case you look for improvement and tuning of your rifle i warmly suggest to consider this option. Your piston rod play room looks fine, but I would call and verify with the importer (or pm papazorro or evlblkwpnz or tac47) and send him a link of your video as well. Still, your point remains. Guilty!!! atf got so so bussy they got better things to do the strip down your gun see if compliant probe is they need The dreaded AK-47 *assault* shotgun, thankyouverymuch. The Vepr 12 has AK-style sights; however, it also has a top rail if you want to mount a red dot or similar optic. I dont get the part about magazines and home defense. Are there otherwise drum magazines to this weapon? Total Length: 42 in / 1070 mm. When you said ten round dump i assume you are refering to from a SGM magazine. You simply cant hold the shortcomings of the Saiga against the VEPR. AK-47 Tips/Tricks, Links, Content and Buyer Guides. Had some MD 20 round drums and standard factory 5 rounds. Based on the RPK standard, the Vepr 12 shares the same legendary . Im not a big fan of thin pieces of metal jutting out off a firearm, especially near my hand, and especially when Im going to fire slugs through it. The fixes are about the same as the Saiga, but there is less need for friction work. I have also posted the same message over at vepr.org as some folks may not know about you guys here at saiga-12.com. Theres a full length rail along the top of the receiver for your optics and other gubbins. Hell, you gave that GI 1911 with sights part of the slide and no rails a 5. You have entered an incorrect email address! I do not know Shannon at Cobra's personally nor is he paying me to endorse him, but I feel strongly about giving credit where credit is due and he definitely delivered what he promised. is this normal? Later models included a fully functional folding stock. Finally, I came across an outfit named Cobra's Custom based in North Carolina and run by a gunsmith named Shannon Neely. It turned out to be the gas ports in the gas block. Bring the price down around $800 and well talk. You need to bend the pegs of your hammer spring towards the outside of the receiver. I find the Vepr 12 section and start a new thread. First off ditch the SGM mag. Are you using the factory magazine or aftermarket? Call me vain, but my second reason for buying a gun after having a use for it is aesthetics. The dust cover is hinged to the shotgun, allowing the user to open and close the cover without losing the zeroing of a mounted optic. Chinese products were not taken into account as in the past already had some issues with them. I swapped the furniture on my VEPR 12 (slant cut, thumbhole stock) and ever since then I've had some issues with trigger reset. The Federal was a little better, but still jammed frequently. Take advantage of our guide rod install service, available here:http://dissidentarms.com/index.php/product/da-recoil-rod-installation/, Works on all Saiga 12, 20, 410 and Vepr 12 shotguns, Abel Anthony Clear editor. Light recoil for a 12 gauge. They continued to happen for the rest of the magazine. Then came the check the gas block and ports. When you say target ammo, it's too vague as there's a hundred different kinds of target ammo. their 00B really are 00 sized, and are generally harder, rounder and plated, as well as buffered. It sure has hell seems like a lot of people commenting on here have never even handled a Vepr 12. Take advantage of our guide rod install service, available here: Recoil Guide Rod Assembly VEPR-12 Dissident Arms, http://dissidentarms.com/index.php/product/15-wolff-recoil-spring/, http://dissidentarms.com/index.php/product/da-recoil-rod-installation/. You can adjust, but shooting at different distances will be an issue.. In the old stone quarry, I ran five loads through the VEPR-12 for patterning at 15 yards. Id also be really embarrassed to show up at work without pants on, but its just about as likely. Ive beaten competitors much better than me that used those in Trooper division simply because their gun didnt work. Is that how Europeans/Russians refer to 12g? I'm thinking that I may have bent the gas tube a bit replacing the guard on that, but it looks within spec and I've been fiddling with it to make sure there isnt an out of spec gap. First, the Saiga and the VEPR are completely different guns. New from Wolf: Optics and Night Vision Sights. Shame on you TTAG. With the array of ammo, loads, shot type, etc, making one that runs everything is near impossible. So bottom line, great gun. Pasted as rich text. Also try not to limp shoulder the weapon. And to Nick: feelings shouldnt really affect things. Overall the VEPR-12 is a dramatic improvement over the Saiga. Were not supposed to call out reviewers on their biases! Given that, it was easy to let the Saiga goguessing the Vepr wouldnt be much different. Somethingto try and may help. Neither worked without gunsmithing with ANY loads. I fire the magnum slugs, I dont see how the safety is a problem, no sharp metal jutting out. Of all the magazines I tried only the 5 rounders were reliable and even those had occasional jams. Eureka!! Why arent top 3 gun shooters using it? Vepr 12 shotguns are designed for self-defense. There is a little round button just behind the mag well, press that bitch up and rack the bolt. [Get your minds out of the gutter], Theres an issue with aiming this gun, thanks to the parallax resulting from the sights being an inch above the top of the barrel. VEPR 12 issues. If run out of ammo, beat enemy to death with magazine!! Most obvious is probably that the gun comes from the factory configured the way youd want it. My Saiga-12 shtogun review comes to mind, in which I detailed exactly why the gun was a piece of crap and the fan boys retorted with well, obviously you need to fix the gun before you test it! cause to beleave its not they just cant arrest us or hold u, they need reason befor they ack, Apparently, guy who has made way too many posts. That is, the bolt locks to the rear of the receiver after the last round has been ejected. From the reports I have seen, Most V12s need something like 3 1/8 Dram eq or hotter to run. yep, just about all AKs have some contact of the rear trunnion with the carrier. First, there are four (4) ratings before the overall. The SF short mags are prolly the best buy for power and other uses, but the max barrier penetration loads have more ass. Take your finger and slowly push the follower downward as deep as you possibly can. Press J to jump to the feed. For the Russian hunting rifle, see, Carbine -206 (VPO-206) with collapsible stock, Learn how and when to remove this template message, "French RAID operator with russian Molot Vepr 12 Semi-Automatic Shotgun", The Vepr 12 "Molot" old official page snapshot, "Army News" NATO putting Vepr-12 "Molot" in service, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vepr-12&oldid=1134448598, 12 Gauge [18.5x70mmR] or 12 Gauge Magnum [18.5x76mmR], This page was last edited on 18 January 2023, at 19:15. Capacity: 4+1 I tried the new performance springs from CSS with no luck. (not one FTF or FTE. For a purchase of 700 (on line all day long) and another, perhaps 100 or less, to make it 922(r) compliant, you cannot find a more reliable shot gun that can shoot assorted types of ammo without adjusting the gas. At first I thought it was because the RPK handguard i got is a tiny bit shorter and it was wiggling out of place but I put the original back on and I still had it happen today. Its much more convenient and a lot quicker to reload. The top front of the mags forward of the feedlips needs to be lowered about 1/8" to allow some over insertion, which should fix this problem. Oh, and the best part: The bolt is held open after the last round fires. It works well for things like skeet and hunting, but when you get into tactical uses or competition shooting the game becomes a test of who can stuff rounds in their gun faster. Unfortunately it had cycling problems the entire time. But for home defense, I just grab the Vaquero or the Glock 21 or the Mossberg and I feel fine with that. No complaints thus far. Even with the availability of Saiga-12 and VEPR-12 shotguns, the pro 3-gun shooters still dont use them. A similar question could ale be asked: why not include price as a gradeable category? With all of this said, I realize that there can be many reasons why a gun will not run as advertised. i know the v12 has its self regulating gas system in which its basically supposed to be able to handle all types of rounds, and i also know that some weapons need a "break in period" to be properly evaluatedbut, from the people ive talked to who are familiar with actual kalashnikovs, im told there isnt supposed to be any play in the gas piston itselfand thats the only explanation i can come up with for this FTE issue. No. The only slugs I run now are the Brenneke. I just read the review and comments section in its entirety. Mine has a small amount of play in it too, but not much. Showing up without them; likely. Third, I say uninformed because as was covered by other responses there is indeed a bolt hold open button that eliminates the supposed need to use an empty magazine to lock the action open. Early versions of the Vepr-12 were produced by Izhmash, with production moving to the Molot factory where the shotgun was redesigned and mass-produced. This can't be done by the end user, as the little front 'lip' would be removed in the process. Due to the large difference in size between the 7.6239mm cartridge and 12-gauge shells, the extractor port has been lengthened, allowing the shotgun to eject spent shells without risk of causing a stovepipe malfunction. Wowlots of Russian shotgun hateToo bad as while granted the Saiga only ran High Brass out of the box (at least mine did as well as others I have seen) the Vepr runs ALL ammo (bird-slug) absent one single modification for WAY Trane Commercial Serial Number Lookup, What Your Favorite Sanrio Character Says About You, Articles V